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Piping Design - how do you design
- hc
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11 years 5 months ago - 11 years 5 months ago #8236 by hc
Piping Design - how do you design was created by hc
Hey Guys,
I've been told that I'm a different type of piping designer. I not sure exactly what this meant but, I design my supports before I run any of my piping. I don't mean fully engineered designed but, I usually end up through my experience being pretty close. I don't wait for structural to get involved. I generally do alot of layout work for them. I do this because I don't feel I can design piping properly if I can't support it efficiently. I know in my head how I want it to look so that's what I work towards. Is this really so different than anyone else. If yes, then how are other people designing? I'd like to know how other people work there way mentally and physically into a project. Do you just design and then let structural fiqure it out? I'm only looking for a generalized answer nothing to in depth.
Regards
I've been told that I'm a different type of piping designer. I not sure exactly what this meant but, I design my supports before I run any of my piping. I don't mean fully engineered designed but, I usually end up through my experience being pretty close. I don't wait for structural to get involved. I generally do alot of layout work for them. I do this because I don't feel I can design piping properly if I can't support it efficiently. I know in my head how I want it to look so that's what I work towards. Is this really so different than anyone else. If yes, then how are other people designing? I'd like to know how other people work there way mentally and physically into a project. Do you just design and then let structural fiqure it out? I'm only looking for a generalized answer nothing to in depth.
Regards
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- Odin1985
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11 years 5 months ago - 11 years 5 months ago #6657 by Odin1985
Replied by Odin1985 on topic Re: Piping Design - how do you design
when i tend to do them, i normaly think of the most efficient route that will provide me with the most cost-efficient product, taking in consideration all the norms and regulation
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- Jop
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11 years 5 months ago - 11 years 5 months ago #6658 by Jop
Do it once and Do it Right
Replied by Jop on topic Re: Piping Design - how do you design
hc,
Your way is the way I did it and the way I have taught all my students over the years. I, like you, try to visualize the finished plant from the start and try to see where the Pipe Racks and individual Pipe Supports need to be.
Remember the first thing done on a Process Plant project (Refinery, Chemical Plant or Power Plant) is develop the Plot Plan. The Plot Plan is required so ALL the other disciplines can do their Scope Of Work, Estimates, Schedule and planning.
To be effective as a planning tool for all groups the Plot Plan must show all major equipment, structures and features. The Pipe Racks are a major feature of the plant and must be well thought out from the very beginning. A properly thought out Pipe Rack system (major and minor racks) helps to bring order to the finished plant and all the work done by Piping, Electrical (Trays), Instruments (raceways), Structural and Construction.
Keep doing it your way "hc" and do not listen to that other school of thought.
Your way is the way I did it and the way I have taught all my students over the years. I, like you, try to visualize the finished plant from the start and try to see where the Pipe Racks and individual Pipe Supports need to be.
Remember the first thing done on a Process Plant project (Refinery, Chemical Plant or Power Plant) is develop the Plot Plan. The Plot Plan is required so ALL the other disciplines can do their Scope Of Work, Estimates, Schedule and planning.
To be effective as a planning tool for all groups the Plot Plan must show all major equipment, structures and features. The Pipe Racks are a major feature of the plant and must be well thought out from the very beginning. A properly thought out Pipe Rack system (major and minor racks) helps to bring order to the finished plant and all the work done by Piping, Electrical (Trays), Instruments (raceways), Structural and Construction.
Keep doing it your way "hc" and do not listen to that other school of thought.
Do it once and Do it Right
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- Jay D M
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11 years 5 months ago - 11 years 5 months ago #6671 by Jay D M
Replied by Jay D M on topic Re: Piping Design - how do you design
I do the supports first as well. Yes, they can be moved and adjusted once the vessels are set and the pipe routed. I just like to know how much room I have to work around the supports.
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- 11echo
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11 years 5 months ago - 11 years 5 months ago #6673 by 11echo
Replied by 11echo on topic Re: Piping Design - how do you design
I tend to do it like Odin1985, I try to visualize the pipe routing, how many pipes, and then I try to support it. I detail my own supports, based around client standards (if any). In my part of the country only supports that are 8'-0" tall and above require permits so we tend to have alot of 7'-11" tall supports. Once I detail out the supports I pass them to the structural group and they finalize them. Saves them alot of time, when all they normally do is add a drawing number to my sketch, maybe bump up the size or weight of a structural member, and add standard construction notes.
I don't think there really is a right or wrong way to do this ...kind of like cooking, no body cares how or what you do, as long as it taste good at meal time! ...AND everybody likes it!
I don't think there really is a right or wrong way to do this ...kind of like cooking, no body cares how or what you do, as long as it taste good at meal time! ...AND everybody likes it!
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- Flowr8
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11 years 5 months ago - 11 years 5 months ago #6674 by Flowr8
Replied by Flowr8 on topic Re: Piping Design - how do you design
Hi hc,
Listen to the advice of experience given here; you're right on the money. I was taught that support placement was part of my job. As Jop points out, the major structures, primarily the piperacks, has to be decided well ahead of time. The modern equivalent to what I used to do manually, and share with the structural group through study drawings, is temporary steel in the 3D models, or "white steel" as it's sometimes referred to, placed by the piping designers for the structural designers to follow.
I remember a brief two year stint many years ago that I spent in the pulp and paper industry coming from the oil and gas industry. I was chastised for placing pipe supports and coordinating these with the structural group because there was a separate pipe support group that dealt with this. I saw the fruits of their labour when I went to the field; pipe hangers to the ceiling blocking the run of an overhead crane.
Listen to the advice of experience given here; you're right on the money. I was taught that support placement was part of my job. As Jop points out, the major structures, primarily the piperacks, has to be decided well ahead of time. The modern equivalent to what I used to do manually, and share with the structural group through study drawings, is temporary steel in the 3D models, or "white steel" as it's sometimes referred to, placed by the piping designers for the structural designers to follow.
I remember a brief two year stint many years ago that I spent in the pulp and paper industry coming from the oil and gas industry. I was chastised for placing pipe supports and coordinating these with the structural group because there was a separate pipe support group that dealt with this. I saw the fruits of their labour when I went to the field; pipe hangers to the ceiling blocking the run of an overhead crane.
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